Back to Basics - A Skyrim Character Building Contest - Skyrim Character Building

Curse April 15, 2020 at 12:16pm

The Ashpit Dragon

Gameplay -

Teccam: 6/10 - Too much going on here for my liking, especially with so much of it being listed as optional. In my opinion, better to just drill down to a more reasonable amount of skills, equipment, passives, etc. and then really build around them and make them support each other. You get a much more cohesive product that way.

Ely: 6/10. I really like the approach to combat, even if Vegetable Soup is such a tired mechanic. Long-range magic backed up by a two-handed weapon is a great combat style, but I feel that between perks in Heavy and Light Armor and Flesh spells, two of them should’ve been dropped. Going halfway into all three just makes all of them less efficient.

Erinoth: (7/10) - I quite like this character’s playstyle. Using magic to enhance melee combat is always a good technique, and I find the spells you chose quite fitting. It is a very thematic character, but I find one thing holds it back. Having eight skills (and an optional nineth) is difficult to balance and level cohesively, especially when we are talking about a character that uses magic. Alteration and Conjuration are both Magicka intensive schools, and I could easily see not having enough magicka to cast your destruction spells.

Avg = 6.333

Presentation -

Teccam: 5/10 - A lot of the “stat sheet” type info could have been condensed via more orderly bulleted lists, and/or images. Perks especially, and equipment too (you already even have an equipment image there -- why not just overlay text onto that image to outline the gear?). Seems like the build is 80% lists/bullets. Better to trim that info into more concise lists or visuals, and then justify it with a bit more of a writeup.

Ely: 4/10. The evolutions of gear and spell lists all could’ve been presented a lot better (like in an image). As they are, the spaces are unequal and they don’t all line up. The first and last screenshot are really good, but the writing is really uninspired. Rather than the bullets, maybe explain some of the choices (like Saviour’s Hide?).

Erinoth: (5/10) - There are things that work here, and things that don’t. I like how you presented the evolution of the character’s gear. I for one do not like having to sort through a build to find the different pieces of equipment one needs to acquire. That said, many elements are not aligned well, and the images are not integrated cohesively into the build.

Avg = 4.6666

Lore -

Teccam: 4/10 - There’s enough that I understand why it needs to be an Orc, and where the character came from. And that info is consistent with established lore. But there isn’t really anything more here.

Ely: 4/10. That opening paragraph got me really pumped. Making the connection between dragons->ash->Ashpit->Orcs is something I’ve never seen before and I really wished you had pushed it further and gone into more detail with a lore-based Orc Dragonborn.

Erinoth: (3/10) - I very much want to like the lore for this build. You provide hints, but there simply isn't enough to build a solid foundation for the build. I would have liked to see a little more effort here. Like I said, there is the seed for something great; you just need to cultivate it.

Avg = 3.6666

Roleplay -

Teccam: 3/10 - There’s virtually nothing explicit here. What little there is is more for the reader to derive based on the intro paragraph and the overall build kit and aesthetic, which just isn’t enough to go off of. There’s not a clearly fleshed out character here.

Ely: 3/10. I’m really not finding any explicit roleplay hints. Sure, Malacath brought them back, but why? What does Malacath want? Who was the Ashpit Dragon before Helgen? Tribe Orc or city Orc? What is their motivation?

Erinoth: (3/10) - Again, there simply was not enough effort put into this section. They are an Orc Zealot, yes, but how do they think when faced with turmoil? How do they view the conflicts in Skyrim? How would one go about getting in the right headspace to play the character?

Avg = 3

Score = 17.666

Likes = 10

Total Score: 27.666

Curse April 15, 2020 at 12:17pm

The Orc Blacksmith

Gameplay -

Teccam: 4/10 - Longhammer + Elemental Fury is a fun combo, but there’s not much to support it, or to separate your use from any other build that uses that setup. I’m sure it plays fine, but it doesn’t really stand out of the crowd in any way -- a bit more ambition could have fleshed this out a lot.

Ely: 5/10. Not every build needs glitches or freaky mechanics, but something a little more special could’ve tied this up. Maybe some more emphasis on Quick Reflexes (and/or Slow Time) to extend survivability.

Erinoth: (5/10) - I am very split here, as there is nothing innately wrong with the blacksmith’s gameplay, but there is also nothing to set it apart from other melee builds. I would have liked to see some unique strategies to make the build stand out.

Avg = 4.666

Presentation -

Teccam: 4/10 - Images dominate the writeup too much. I’d advise either reducing the image sizes, or adding some more text between them, to strike a better balance. Separating the sections with big, bold headers would help a lot. Generally, using more text formatting would add a lot of polish.

Ely: 4/10. I gave an extra point because I don’t think I’ve seen most of those images in builds before. Even so, there’s too many images to too little writing. There are also some grammar errors and the sections aren’t very distinct.

Erinoth: (3/10) - Very basic presentation over all, but the images were somewhat well placed. To take this to the next level, You need to create a sense of hierarchy by making titles larger, placing more emphasis on them.

Avg = 3.666

Lore -

Teccam: 4/10 - There’s a context to the character, but it’s quite simple. I could be wrong, but I believe the “blood price” is actually an established aspect of Orcish custom, a punishment for those who violate the Code of Malacath. Your use of the phrase does not seem to apply -- not sure if this is just a coincidence that you’ve come up with the same term, or if one of us is misinterpreting its use.

Ely: 4/10. There’s a great lore basis for the Legion blacksmith Orc, but it doesn’t go much further than that aside from being “Orc-y”. Teccam’s also right about the blood price.

Erinoth: (4/10) - You have good bones here, and there is definitely strong lore to support the idea of an Orc smith that supports the empire. I would have loved to see you flesh out the backstory more and perhaps weave it an interesting way. That said, the foundation and lore the Blacksmith is built upon works.

Avg = 4

Roleplay -

Teccam: 5/10 - There’s enough to establish a clear character, but not enough to make the character particularly compelling or unique. As with most of the build, a bit more detail would go a long way toward making this one pop.

Ely: 5/10. I’m sure she was fun to play. There’s a good basis for a “commoner” playthrough, but I would’ve liked to see her grow more into a Dragonborn or Imperial Legion-based hero.

Erinoth: (4/10) - Very standard roleplay elements, but they provide enough information on how the character behaves. We see female orc smiths in strongholds, and certainly a few examples of female smiths among the Stormcloaks, but there are no in-game instances of female orc smiths in the empire. Perhaps you could have weaved a story around the idea of proving herself, or overcoming her doubts.

Avg = 4.666

Score = 16.998

Likes = 6

Total Score: 22.998

Curse April 15, 2020 at 12:19pm

The Dark Defender

Gameplay -

Teccam: 7/10 - First criticism is too many potions. I would try to limit it to 3-5. Keep the pool of new material small enough that any reader can keep it all in their head. I’m not convinced your numbers are quite accurate regarding Flame Cloak -- the potion buffs its magnitude for you, but I don’t think you’re getting anything more from Flame Cloak by dual casting another spell. If this trick does work, then it almost feels like a disservice to include it as a sort of afterthought -- there’s a bit of dissonance between the human mage playstyle and the combat archer style; both serve super similar functions stylistically and practically speaking. I like the idea of pushing into the melee side of Vamp Lord form -- personally I find it quite underwhelming compared to Beast Form / mage Vamp Lord, but you used some good mechanics to make it more powerful and unique.

Ely: 7/10. I like that you used Vampire Lord in melee, it feels like a natural compliment to a warrior/combat archer, but I don’t feel that the mage combat style fits in well. If the dual-casting another spell while using Flame Cloak works (I don’t mean to doubt you, but I’ve never heard of this before), it feels extra and like a really solid build mechanic on its own.

Erinoth: (7/10) - I feel that there are many solid points that you make for the various skills the Defender uses in combat. Overall, I think your vampire form gameplay far exceeds everything else from an enjoyability standpoint. I quite like the Idea of a melee heavy vampire lord. As for your humanoid techniques, I think relying on poison is uninspired and quite dull, especially as an archer; however, the techniques you present are valid. I also appreciate the low target level of 32. One complaint of mine is that I was uncertain about the dual channeling to bolster flame cloak strategy, and was unable to replicate it myself.

Avg = 7

Presentation -

Teccam: 7/10 - The framework of a great presentation is mostly here, but there are some areas that could have been significantly improved to elevate this from a great framework to a great execution. Points for inline images, good spacing, and the presentation video. More consistency and aesthetic appeal could have been applied for the alchemy image, perk spread and section headers. Some careless mistakes throughout (“your” vs. “you’re”, “it” vs. “is”, etc.).

Ely: 5/10. Average and unoffensive. Some pictures, a perkspread that’s readable, and even a few screenshots. It could use some more pizazz, like more unique images or WordArt/Cooltext headers, and there’s a few grammatical errors.

Erinoth: (6/10) - Fairly standard overall, albeit well done. There was the occasional grammatical error, and a few inconsistencies across the different sections. Nothing major, but plenty of room to improve. Of particular note, I think a little more effort could be put into the perk spread.

Avg = 6

Lore -

Teccam: 6/10 - There isn’t a ton here, but what there is is definitely reasonable. The Volkihar, the Civil War, these are relevant to the game but they don’t seem to really drive the character in combat. More like high level governing objectives. Could have gone into more depth with these lore elements and bound them to the day-to-day play style.

Ely: 4/10. While I enjoy the character a lot, there isn’t a lot of lore actually built into the character or playthrough.

Erinoth: (5/10) - Nothing exceptional here, although I did not notice anything directly wrong with the ideas present. I feel that the lore was quite split from the gameplay side of things.

Avg = 5

Roleplay -

Teccam: 7/10 - Echoing the feedback below by Erinoth, I think you came up with a reasonably interesting character here, but you didn’t really sow the seeds to give it complexity or justification. For practical purposes, it feels like we meet the character after they already turn to vampirism, and we miss out on so much characterization because of that. Just a tad more backstory and some period roleplay commentary throughout the writeup could easily elevate this to a 9 for me. As it is, it feels like you’re boiling down a potentially super interesting character into a handful of simple objectives/rules to follow. Great foundation, could use some polish.

Ely: 6/10. The base idea is something I love and a really tried and true character design. There’s enough of the character to allow a player to flesh it out on their own in your framework, but I wish there had been a little more meat on it.

Erinoth: (5/10) - There are a few points here I have an issue with. From what you present, there is no “breaking point” at which the character feels that Vampirism is the only way to gain enough power to protect her homeland. I feel like this could be fleshed out quite a bit more. Did she ever experience a major defeat? When did her ideals become so twisted as to believe that a daedra’s boon was the path to success?

Avg = 6

Score = 24

Likes = 9

Total Score: 33

TexasC4 > Curse April 15, 2020 at 4:55pm

Great critiques and thank yall taking the time to give such specific feedback. I might give this build a bit of a rework to incorporate some of these points. After I read about the dual casting trick on Flame Cloak page off UESP, I did a bunch of testing and verified it does work in vanilla Skyrim, but I believe the unofficial patch fixes this bug. If anyone is interested or has trouble replicating it, send me a message as I'm happy to get into the details of it. That said, I can definetly see how it feels like a bit of an addon to this build and the comment that it deserves its own build sparked a couple ideas.
- Teccam > TexasC4 April 15, 2020 at 7:25pm
  
  Hey there. I went ahead and checked out the UESP article you're referring to, and since you are so sure this does work, I went ahead and tested it today. I didn't have time to test when I was scoring originally (I was actually doing it remotely without access to my Skyrim installation), so I had to go with my gut. But I am home now and your insistence on this made me want to verify for myself. My testing is pretty conclusive: You are right about this mechanic.
  
  I feel badly; I most likely would have given you an extra point in gameplay for this if I had known. So please accept my apology and consider your score to be a point higher. I do stand by the point of feedback that this mechanic could make for the foundation of a separate build, rather than a sort of afterthought. Since you agree that this is worthy of its own build, and explored in more depth, I'm definitely looking forward to see what you come up with.
  
  If you'd like to brainstorm ideas for what else to do with this mechanic in future, I'd be happy to help out. I already have a thought or two, even. Not sure if you're in the Skyforge discord server, but I'm on there pretty much every day. I'm not quite as good at checking my inbox on the Skyforge, but I'll keep an eye out here too in case you do want to talk.
  
  Again, I'm sorry for doubting you, and for not being able to confirm that mechanic before the scores went in. You've earned that extra point in my book, and I hope you show us some more cool new stuff soon!
  - TexasC4 > Teccam April 15, 2020 at 8:34pm
    
    No apology necessary. I actually didn't believe it at first either and it wasn't until after quite a bit of testing I was convinced. Let me think on it a little bit but then I'd love to brainstorm on a build idea centered around that mechanic.

Curse April 15, 2020 at 12:25pm

The Warlock of Bargains

Gameplay -

Teccam: 7/10 - First off - I was absolutely blown away by the assertion that the Masque of Clavicus Vile uses the same form of Magicka Regen bonus as the Ring of the Erudite … So much so, that I needed to look under the hood and see for myself. It looks to me like your claim is incorrect, unfortunately. I can’t say I proved this in game, but the Creation Kit indicates it’s using the standard MagickaRateMult, rather than MagickaRate (which is what the Ring of the Erudite uses). And the magnitude is set to 5, by the way. If this had checked out, I’d probably be giving this one a 9. I like the progression approach you used, the scope, and the overall style. Even like the use of a relatively well-trodden glitch, by spicing it up with a clear and present downside. Nice video link, by the way -- whoever posted that video must be very cool!

Ely: 8/10. I really like it. Even, like Teccam says, if your MagickaRate on the Masque is wrong, I think the pact mechanics are really cool and have tangible downsides. I’m always a fan of mage builds and the misdirection of Illusion/Conjuration is a good base. Both mage playstyles of unlimited regen and max absorption are cool but normally impossible to integrate, but you managed to fit them together.

Erinoth: (8/10) - To me, this is almost everything a compelling build should be. You tie gameplay directly into lore, forge a solid foundation for a unique character that stands out among other mages, and allow the character to make a decision that impacts the rest of the game. Absolutely phenomenal. The item holding me back from giving a perfect score in this section is the sheer difficulty and limitations of certain playstyles. Having an exponential weakness to magic makes vanilla combat against one of the most notable enemies, Dragons, nigh impossible. Likewise, 100% magic absorption makes combat too easy against them, but difficult when you face non-magic enemies. I would have appreciated some tactics on how to overcome these weaknesses.

Avg = 7.666

Presentation -

Teccam: 7/10 - Good use of images, though there are sections that still feel a bit text-heavy, and some images could be polished and/or integrated better into the writeup.

Ely: 7/10. Good images. I like the presentation of the pacts and potions, but Erinoth is right about the perk spread.

Erinoth: (5/10) - It is evident that some effort was put into formating, but I also feel that there is considerable room for improvement. The most notable item being the perk spread. Using multiple colors of text makes the image painful to look at and difficult to read. I appreciate the consistent formatting throughout the build, which helps with flow.

Avg = 6.3333

Lore -

Teccam: 7/10 - Interesting and reasonably specific take on a lore foundation, with the focus on a specific Daedric Prince. The character is driven by making bargains, which is perfectly fitting with Vile’s nature. A bit simple, but certainly justifiable.

Ely: 6/10. There’s a good grounding of lore in Clavicus Vile and expands on a Daedric Prince we don’t know much about (and the note to D&D Warlocks), but I wish there had been something a little deeper to tie the character to Vile or how to justify the main quest.

Erinoth: (6/10) - I like the tie-in to Clavicus Vile, as it makes sense and helps ground the character in the world. That said, much of your lore is copy-paste information, and I would have appreciated a little more effort in fusing the character with the lore.

Avg = 6.333

Roleplay -

Teccam: 8/10 - I like the theme. It feels like a sort of mashup of a Vader to Vile’s Palpatine, and a classic D&D Warlock. The roleplay notes themselves are a bit barebones, but I think the writeup largely sets up the roleplay without even getting to that section. I agree with Erinoth’s comment about motivation being a bit murky, but overall, despite not being 100% sold on why he turned down this path, I certainly have a fair impression of who he is today.

Ely: 6/10. I’m struggling to figure out who he is. The tie to Clavicus Vile is the base of this build, but the character is driven by a desire for power — including the Black Books — leaving the actual character and the idea of the build at odds. Also, if there are three pacts for three very different types of power, maybe expand on the terms of the pacts, or why they were chosen.

Erinoth: (6/10) - I have one major issue with the character’s motive. Power is not a goal, but a tool. You provide a snippet at the beginning mentioning how the character may use the power. Elaborate on that. Perhaps provide a goal for each pact to fulfil, so that there is reason for choosing a certain path.

Avg = 6.6666

Score = 26.998

Likes = 10+

Total Score: 36.998

Curse April 15, 2020 at 12:27pm

The Wayfaring Wanderer

Gameplay -

Teccam: 7/10 - Nothing earthshattering here, but it’s cohesive and it sounds like it makes for exciting combat. Feels like an heir apparent to Mason’s classic Alik’r, which is one of the builds that got me into this community about eight years ago. It’s a tried and true combat style, but it works. I would have liked to see a bit more uniqueness -- maybe push more into the bash/bleed approach that the Targe is begging for you to explore, for instance. Or swap between a spellsword vs. sword&board vs. duelist style (open off hand) to make combat a bit more dynamic.

Ely: 8/10. Specialising only in five skills means they’re all used to their maximum and the ones you’ve chosen all synergise into a cohesive warrior. Nothing is groundbreaking, but I love the more unique mechanics (Targe, shouts) to make a standard warrior build just that bit more interesting.

Erinoth: (9/10) - Many of the elements you present make for solid gameplay. First, limiting yourself to five skills is fantastic, as not only does it make perk management easier, but helps for a unique character as they are unable to do everything. Furthermore, using one crafting skill (and one that makes sense for the build I must say) minimizes grinding. Well done. The only critique I have is that become ethereal does not fit the “sellsword” aesthetic, but I can overlook this easily as the build uses alteration.

Avg = 8

Presentation -

Teccam: 7/10 - Not enough Redguard builds. It’s always good to see one. I felt the aesthetic similarities to the Sword-Singer from early on, and while your build certainly stands on its own two feet, it was kind of you to mention my build there. Overall, the writeup is short but sweet (and I won’t lie, I sometimes think current build standards promote overly lengthy builds). Solid screenshots, concise, sold well. The formatting could be improved with some better spacing. The perk spread also feels a tad simple. Nothing really sets this over the top for me, but it’s clean and clear and there are no glaring problems either.

Ely: 7/10. Great presentation. Very clean. I like the perkspread, and the bolded emphasis. It makes it easy to read and remember. The screenshots are nice, but you could’ve added some headers or smaller images to break up the words.

Erinoth: (8/10) - Solid, but nothing phenomenal. I appreciate the short and sweet philosophy with this build, as you forgo long-winded backstory elements in favor of diving straight into the meat of the build. An area of improvement I can see is that your perk spread is somewhat difficult to read. Try experimenting with color harmonies rather than trying to match the colors of the screenshot directly.

Avg = 7.333

Lore -

Teccam: 5/10 - Nothing offensive or improbable here, but nothing really notable either. The historical context of the Great War puts him in Skyrim, but doesn’t really define or drive the character. The use of magic could be supported a bit more, since traditionally, it’s not really something Redguards gravitate toward. (I know Kematu uses a Paralysis spell against Saadia, but honestly that always felt to me like a technical limitation on Bethesda’s part than anything else; I also know there are Redguard mages in lore, but I like to see a bit of justification for it regardless).

Ely: 5/10. I’m sure there’s plenty of guys like him around, so I fully believe this character has a role in the world of Skyrim, but there’s nothing more interesting to engrain him in the world. You could’ve emphasised his Redguard origins more, or what happened to him to make him desert in the Great War.

Erinoth: (4/10) - You have an excellent foundation, I simply wish there was more to it. Build off the seeds you planted with the Great War. What led the Wanderer to Skyrim? Where did he come from? etc.

Avg = 4.666

Roleplay -

Teccam: 7/10 - I think there’s enough info and context here to make it apparent who this character is, and how he would react to most situations. I’d like to see more about his purpose and goals -- you describe him as “drifting aimlessly”, which doesn’t exactly promote a compelling forestory. But there’s enough to get some semblance of a picture.

Ely: 7/10. Lore and roleplay are very intertwined, but I feel like I would know how to play this character. It’s a pretty standard archetype (like you said, “lost warrior with a conscience”), but there’s enough leeway to let players put their own stamp on it.

Erinoth: (5/10) - I want to like the roleplay aspect of the build, but like the lore section, I wish there was more. Leaving most of the decision making up to the player does not foster good roleplaying and can easily fall into the trope of playing a game, rather than a character.

Avg = 6.333

Score = 26.332

Likes = 10+

Total Score: 36.332

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